Is it good or bad?

Is it a good initiative to invite listed students to join my Group thro’ a message or
is it a blatantly unethical spam?

Sorry for the inconvenience.

Narendran

I think a lot depends on how you invite. If you mention it once in a while, I think it’s fine. If you mention it all the time, it gets to be tiresome.

Certainly no need to apologise Narendran.

In addition to Agnes’s comments, I wanted to add a word of caution. If your messages get marked as ‘spam’ by 5 people, your ability to send messages will stop. So as Agnes said, be careful as to the wording.

Certainly post regularly on the forums and ask other teachers for marketing advice too. You want to reach the stage where students are coming to you.

Let me know if you need any help but certainly your first stop is the Tutor Talk section.

Thanks Marco and Agnes,

My point was whether a personal invitation is ethical or not. The idea was not to market my group. I see a group as a hub for exchange of experience and knowledge, as you might have seen in forums such as Orkut. But since the very word invitation seems to connote marketing and thereby spamming, why will anyone do it and end up on the wrong side for something one does so consciously and conscientiously for the other’s benefit?

So no such indulgence is the wiser counsel.

Thanks once again,

Narendran

We have come to a point where getting invited to something is no longer an honor. Kinda sad, really.

Take a look at Ron Smith (not related to me LOL) profile page. He has a button there if someone wants to join his mailing list. It’s perfect as it doesn’t spam, but it’s visible enough that interested people will see it. Proof in the pudding…. I joined ;).

Oh Come On Aunt Agnes! Why not tell everyone I am your favorite nephew!

There is one other thing I want to address as well. I was discussing how tutors can use the eduFire inbox to keep students informed about a class after they signed up during my 8 Weeks to Profits class on Saturday and I asked the question how the class members decided on which classes they decided to join. My question was more in line with where they found their classes – was it through the eduFire class pages or from the eduFire class forum section. One response intrigued me. It was stated by one student in the class that she liked to be invited to classes.

I, like several others in the class was intrigued by the answer and so I asked her to explain in more detail. She stated that after she has enjoyed taking a few free courses from an instructor that she doesn’t mind being invited by that instructor to classes that may be similar.

This somewhat justifies my strong belief that tutors new to the eduFire platform should take the opportunity to get to know the community through the use of free classes. As Marco has stated, be very careful because 5 messages marked as spam will get mailing priveledges suspended.

So post positive and frequent messages in the forums and work to develop one-of-a-kind classes here on eduFire. Offer to be the friend first and potential students will eagerly seek your services.

And by the way, welcome to eduFire!
Ron

I don’t know much about this, but I have sent a couple of personal invitations through messages — in both cases, it was to join something that was actually free, and was a followup to a conversation that had started on the forums or in another class. I’ve never sent a marketing email in my life; if somebody is on my website, I never know unless they email me, as I use no analytics and take down no information whatsoever. Yet the idea of an invitation being spam seems very strange to me. I generally wouldn’t send anything to somebody who wasn’t on my friends list and I hadn’t been conversing with, though.

@ Ron

In which case, Dear Ron, why can’t we ask the student whether one likes to be invited or not, when he or she joins? If yes only, invitations will go. To all other DNDs, no invites will go, just as we do selectively in the case of our follow up emails to our postings.

To me, the problem here seems to be one of lack of awareness. So many tutors seem to be willing to offer free classes but not many students seem to be taking. Can it be that people are not aware? May be yes or may be no. Take the case of your own lone student, who expects to be invited in spite of knowing her tutor quite well. Isn’t it dogmatic to argue that if the tutor was so good, why wouldn’t she go in search of him? At this point, the student, our customer seems to be a right royal guest and he wouldn’t come unless invited.

Take the case of GMAT. There are 170 listed students, And among them., even if there are 10 students who are willing to be informed about something related to their subject, a free class, a free article or a free material or one whom I can ask for participation and opinion, I will be extreme glad. It is when these students get benefited, then the other “touch me nots” will be after us. Why then bother about them just now?

The axiom that the results will go and ring the bells ultimately holds true not only of individuals but also of those larger communities that hold the individuals. Ethics and etiquettes are important parameters of a culture, not the be all and end all. Let us unfetter ourselves and set new paradigms in order to become visible.

Please correct me Ron, if I am wrong.

@ Karen: Thanks Karen, You have highlighted the point well.

ROFL @ Ron! Are you trying to get on my Christmas list? I’d be honored, actually :)!

I see your point, Narendran. Anywhere on the internet, we’re all a very tiny drop in a large bucket. I think the main point is that unsolicited invites from people we don’t know are not welcome. Personal invites from people we do know may be welcome, depending on a variety of factors.

For example, a while back, Dave invited me to one of his classes. I know Dave from his participating in the forums, he’s on my friends list, and we have further communicated by email about web hosting (a service he offers independently from eduFire). From our previous communication, Dave knew that I have some interest in the topics he teaches. Obviously, I did not consider it spam. Too bad I couldn’t make it, as Dave has also established himself as a reliable tutor, a helpful person in the forum, and an authority in his field.

On the other hand, I also received an invitation from a tutor that I do not know. This person asked me to attend a French class. I happen to be French, and when I joined eduFire, had the intention to teach French. That is noted in my profile. While I did not report this, and don’t consider a single (if inappropriate) invite as spam, I also did not attend that class.

There is one other point that Karen alludes to. She invited someone to “join something that was actually free”. I really do not think that cost is a factor in classifying something as spam or not. Maybe I’m wrong about this?

I don’t know that cost is actually a factor in whether something is spam, but I think think people are less likely to see it as advertising. I don’t really feel comfortable sending people advertisements, but of course advertisements aren’t necessarily spam!

On a related note, I am a little puzzled by the directing of messages ‘at’ people on public forums. Is it fear or convenience that has brought about the ‘at’ culture…. or simply because we are directing our words to a dual audience? I always kind of assumed that you generally sent group messages on a forum and individualized messages through an email or message system, but I realize this is not the case for most people.

And there are definitely times when I am addressing a dual audience.

I do not mind the mass emails of organizations I joined. My major concern is those that try to trick me into believing it is a private note yet I don’t doubt that they are a mass-campaign.

Well Agnes! I have great respect for your views. But let me add on: if as a GMAT tutor, I am still a stranger to those who have professed to have come to learn GMAT in this community , what thread is holding us within Edufire? I am not inviting a student of “Alaskan way Life” to see what I have scribbled on the wall of my GMAT group Why is the lurking suspicion that one will only spam? By such ado about nothing, aren’t we alienating ourselves? Are the Edufire tutors so desperate to invite unwilling guests? But let me tell you that on the contrary, I do not speak for others, genuine Test Prep students are so hungry for knowledge that they will prostrate and thank you if you called them and gave them true knowledge that is hard to come by elsewhere. If one is not confident of doing it, it is better that he keeps quite But do you see the reason why test prep is languishing?

Agnes Your worry is one of etiquette. My worry is one of concept. If we say that inviting a student is spamming and bad manners, let us call it so. But I couldn’t stomach saying that up to five time it is ok kind of manners and thereafter it is bad. Or it is acceptable if you can shroud your invite in a flowery garb so that the receiver doesn’t think it is spam, but if you forthrightly request him, it is bad. I would reckon this hypocrisy is worse than the curse.

Agnes, you are as much right as I am in my own right. Regards

Very interesting discussion!

My impression was that there is a consenus among the tutors that sending a friendship invitation and one(!) message advertising the tutor’s courses and/or groups to each new student is acceptable. And I think this is fine. If a tutor with whom I had no contact would send me several unsolicited messages advertising his or her classes and/or groups, I would probably first ask him or her to stop it before reporting any of the messages as spam.

Well, that’s my point of view.

Narendran,
You are absolutely correct. Test Prep, as well as many other subjects, are very much in demand. My point, in my 2nd example was that this particular tutor had had no prior contact, does not seem to participate in the forum, and did not use any target marketing techniques.

My other business is done online, when I started it, posting your email address was no big deal, so I get a lot of emails (some good and some clearly unwanted). It is possible that my view is askew due to my being online for a long time and to the sheer quantity I receive each day.

@Karen: I see the use of @someone replies as an easy way to reference to what you’re replying to. In this case, you and I are having a little side conversation, but still related to the main topic. Of course, if it weren’t related, it would have gone on a separate thread so as not highjack Narendran’s thread which would have been rude of me to do. I guess I’m back to etiquette :).

@Martin: I think that is reasonable.